BonzaiJakab (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

Jesus Christ is the SAVIOR.

ilikezappa (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

greetings! I have brought good news! We have science and learning now , which has convincingly consigned religious superstition to the dustbin of medieval falsehood. You no longer have to consider priests as wearing the badge of honour. Rather, question their assertions and ask them to provide some evidence or be still. Dont let them tell you you can cheat death. You cannot.Put them in the same box as tarot cards , astrologers , mediums , republicans and amways salesmen. RUBBISH.

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

Its not torture its torment, physical/mental anguish of being separated from the source of life meaning God,biblical verses in support of this include being cast out weeping and gnashing of teeth,it can apply to pain but it can also apply to having lost something priceless(losing loved ones)God's emotions on this is one of disgust,not delight,he wants repentance,not punishment,he called judgement his STRANGE work,he DESIRES that the wicked seek repentance and live.

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

then why the hell would you say "ETERNAL MURDER" by god? you did say something about this. and I didn't say degrees in HELL, I said degrees AND PUNISHMENTS. the bible explains servants having known the master's will yet still continued to do wicked deeds got punished with MANY blows and servants who did NOT know got dealt with FEW blows.

dave1122drum (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

degrees in hell? where is that in the bible? Annihilation is erased from existence -I never said anything about that just that God's punishment is of a eternal, torturous existence carried out by the emotions of a killer. Jonathan Edwards brutality.

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

There is one difference between secular humanitarianism and christian missionary work, it is the gospel. they both do social programs, but the christian does it one step further he preaches to the masses,because he/she wants them to have an opportunity to be saved. its much heinous, if the christian kept the goodnews to himself, rather than sharing it, secular workers however, prioritize on doing good works in the name of democracy or human rights

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

As for world peace, I agree with you it is common ground, but unbelievers and oh god, there lie such a spectrum (from lazy pessimists, optimistic humanists, to violent marxists, new atheists) would simply argue what does "good" and "peace" mean? violent overthrow of govt and religion? elimination of poverty? or don't care cause its my life...They would end up contradicting with one another on how to go about it.

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

its banishment, not annihilation, when i meant degrees, in that Hitler will be punished much more severely for his sins than avg joe unbeliever, who simply didn't believe when the gospel was preached to him, although the good that he did would still count, but its not enough to make him "saved"

dave1122drum (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

no, not really. Everyone in hell(if it existed) will undergo the same eternal murder by god. The average joe will suffer the same as Hitler in hell. There are no 7 levels of hell. Intentions? What about a common goal between believers and non like world peace? Say if we achieved it, how can Christ call the unbelievers not good when the believers couldn't have achieved world peace without the nonbelievers help? He would have to thank everyone for there efforts. How can christ cast out christ?

psyknai (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

I agree, but in degree and punishment under God's Standard, Hitler deserves more..than the average joe unbeliever living a routinary life. Also intentions determine longterm consequences, what if a person values a person as long as he/she has worth to him/her, but when the person's usefulness expires,that person can just as well abandon caring for that person, you see motives are important in that they have an overview of the implications of what an external act's consequences are.